Is inefficient repair necessary at this point?

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IgRA
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Is inefficient repair necessary at this point?

Post#1 » Tue May 21, 2019 2:54 pm

The thing is - scout has always been one of my favourite classes. Playing it has some sort of freedom in comparsion to other classes, in many ways: where you go on the map, how much you kill, what role you can support with your activity at a given time, etc.
But one thing scout was always superior at is emergent repairing of stations. So it was nerfed and since then scout required toolkit to be as good at this as he was before.
No surprise what toolkit has been a dominant choise since the nerf and every successful scout would pick it. There was time when out of all classes only scout would pick tk but now it got buffed a lot and you would want even less to ever change it for something else.
Classes rely too much on scout repairing stuff. Whenever he doesn't pick tk something breaks while others do their jobs and the role feels like failed his task by default, by choosing the wrong equipment. Ropes sometimes can help to cooperate and make people repair by themselves, but only when their routes are going close to the station it isn't a big deal, otherwise another class will have to do scout's job instead of theirs and it is just better to pick tk in the first place.
I actually think this is the only issue with scout's equipment currently. If you didn't have to get tk then literally any option has usefulness and strategy in it.
I have an idea how to fix repair but still have it nerfed if we really need to punish babysitting: the repair could have interruptable warm up and any damage would interrupt repair. Stopping repair would also take about 2.5 seconds, be it manually or by taking damage. Scout would be stimulated to have an escort when going to repair some distant station. Also scout would have harder time repairing smaller things like doors, which require to be on guard.

Lemon
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Re: Is inefficient repair necessary at this point?

Post#2 » Wed May 22, 2019 6:10 am

This is such a bad idea to solve the nerfed repair. Punish babysitting facilities and takes 2.5s to stop repair? With how vulnerable scout becomes, he needs a medic as babysitter to heal him back up at every corner of the map.

And of course scouts are our plan-B repair, since it was initially used for hybrid. Some agents don't pick hacktool (they say it's useless) and think "oh, I don't have hack or toolkit so what do I care about hybrid" so we gave scout the job. As scout had no repair nerf back then, scout become a good repair unit around the whole map. Then Dark gave us the nerfed repair. So scout was forced to take toolkit to keep up his forced-on job. His mobility and the ability to repair so fast became strong.
... But Igra, it's not as shiny as you think. A scout could take scanner to deal with creepers and larvas without risk. A scout could take flares to take the pistol-sniper loadout and "finally" have no problems against hydras anymore. Some scout may even take communicator to quickly deal with fake survivors or bring good survivors to safety.
There are plenty others jobs scout could do. But we simply force the scout to take toolkit because the other teams are usually busy or out of position.
Sure some say "Engi is perfect to repair" but some also say "If Engi takes toolkit, it's a fail" and the passive "little toolkit" may doesn't convince an engi to be a "repair unit".
Evo said Hybrid should be everyone's job but in reality it's not. It can not be. Because often situations don't allow it.

But not all is lost.
This will be wierd for me and maybe some others, but let's see how it goes when Agents take toolkit.
I remember back in 2015 when the Agent was op... Rest in supplies, my friend.

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Dark
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Re: Is inefficient repair necessary at this point?

Post#3 » Thu May 23, 2019 12:59 pm

I'd love to address this problem somehow.
Scout with normal repair used to be OP. Mostly by babysitting Containment Field but also in repairing all other facilities due to his mobility. He practicly became the "real engineer".
I don't like the idea of forcing Scout into picking Toolkit and right now it might be a bit too good.

Perhaps just nerfing Scout's Toolkit repair would do?
- Scout without Toolkit = inferior repair (as it is now).
- Scout with Toolkit = (more or less) same repair as other class without Toolkit.

Btw, lately I feel like Containment Field might be a bit too dominant in a match. It's breaking down more often than not. I'm considering to increase it's reactivation timer.

Lemon
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Re: Is inefficient repair necessary at this point?

Post#4 » Fri May 24, 2019 1:03 am

Scout is not really going to be used for containment field repairs anymore. Mainly because the ropes next to hybrid, makes it easier and faster for other classes. EU now has some Agents with hacktool that do the Containment field as well, mainly because 2 datahubs are close by. So I guess that's out of the picture.
Your nerf idea about scout's toolkit doesn't "sound" to bad but let's see how the community in both EU and KR reacts to it.
I remember back in 2015 when the Agent was op... Rest in supplies, my friend.

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IgRA
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Re: Is inefficient repair necessary at this point?

Post#5 » Fri May 24, 2019 3:51 pm

I finally have time to reply, so here it goes:

What i'm looking for is another way to solve the issue, i'm not convinced what nerfed repair is good. Repairing is the core element of every player and when it's this bad your strategy is to ignore everything repairable and do something else all the time. It's all good what there are other tools but after earlygame basically all you do what other classes can't already do better than you is replenishing ledges and sniping, other equipment doesn't make it up entirely. Yes you have better mobility still, but in the lategame it often is not as important. In a way it's also counterintuitive what your minimap has so many pings and you ignore all of them. Playing doesn't feel whole. I'l try to explain it like that: most of the times it's what other classes either do their job so well so when you finish roping and droning you've got little to do, or it goes bad and hardcore-ish. In this situation scout is the one getting the most pressure, when it's the only class which seemingly can be in multiple places and do multiple jobs instead of the dead guys. When this happens it's when tools get to be hard tested and then it can be seen what without repair you can't really make it, while with regular repair you would and with toolkit you would. Not because of lack of skill or bad luck sadly, but because repair is such a big of a deal.

About delay to repair or stop, I don't think it's that bad, when repairing you already have delay around 1.5 seconds before or after and it's fine as you look around beforehand. For scout, he has drones to see enemy further and this would help, and keep in mind scout doesn't repair at all with current version unless it's table and he has yellow larva and nobody near to do this for him. Anyway, my idea is focused on making this task more dangerous, cos danger is in my opinion way more enjoyable to deal with than game mechanic balanced to be punishingly ineffecient. It's just one way of doing that, I was also thinking about repairing making loud sounds, grabbing nearby enemies' attention.

I'm honestly fine with toolkit nerfed repair speed, be it globally or solely for scout. Toolkit might repair too quick. I like when it takes long to repair something when it makes for good gameplay, for example when you have to protect the guy who repairs door with enemies behind it or the shuttle. You know, I would be fine if all big facilities would take 1.5 times longer to repair if this had more or less same effects to everyone.

9AQU9
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Re: Is inefficient repair necessary at this point?

Post#6 » Fri May 24, 2019 5:56 pm

For me and will never play scout again it's nerf and scout will not gain anything

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Artacker
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Re: Is inefficient repair necessary at this point?

Post#7 » Fri May 24, 2019 7:19 pm

When I repairing Containment on hell difficulty as scout without toolkit (or datahub) i have time go after my other hobbies...

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